Discussion:
Can you name a single Android app you use that you can't update?
(too old to reply)
Robin Goodfellow
2021-10-21 20:09:44 UTC
Permalink
Can you name a single Android app you use that you can't update?

In a recent thread, The Real Bev mentioned the possibility of apps that
can't be updated because the Android device was purportedly "too old."

Yet, it's my understanding that Google has been updating its core Android
apps for over 8 years (last we discussed this), so the phone has to be
_really_ (really!) old for it to not have the apps updatable, right?

Admittedly Android updates for 8 years is a bit old for a smartphone, so
let's try to limit this to something reasonable like Android 7 & up.

Android 7.0 was released August 22nd, 2016 so that's about five years.

If your phone is Android 7 & above, may I ask you to tell us which apps you
have on that phone that you can justify the use of that you can't update?
The Real Bev
2021-10-21 22:17:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Goodfellow
Can you name a single Android app you use that you can't update?
In a recent thread, The Real Bev mentioned the possibility of apps that
can't be updated because the Android device was purportedly "too old."
I was thinking of the Androids themselves, not the apps.

BUT I just thought of TWO apps that I can't update. One is the
Navionics ski app, which I actually spent a buck for. At some point
they eliminated the ski-appropriate parts and made it boat-only. Same
with a Human Body thing -- I can't remember what they did, but they said
I could apply my payment to any of their other apps, none of which
interested me.

I have over 100 apps, most of which I rarely (if ever) use. When I do a
batch update I just lay the phone down and walk away, so I have no idea
if any of them refuse to update. What I find mystifying is why UPDATE
ALL generally stops with some that haven't been updated, requiring me to
tap UPDATE ALL again. What part of ALL do they not understand?
--
Cheers, Bev
"You won't like me when I'm angry because I always back up my rage
with facts and documented sources." - The Credible Hulk
VanguardLH
2021-10-22 00:07:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Goodfellow
Can you name a single Android app you use that you can't update?
In a recent thread, The Real Bev mentioned the possibility of apps
that can't be updated because the Android device was purportedly "too
old."
Yet, it's my understanding that Google has been updating its core
Android apps for over 8 years (last we discussed this), so the phone
has to be _really_ (really!) old for it to not have the apps
updatable, right?
Admittedly Android updates for 8 years is a bit old for a smartphone,
so let's try to limit this to something reasonable like Android 7 &
up.
Android 7.0 was released August 22nd, 2016 so that's about five years.
If your phone is Android 7 & above, may I ask you to tell us which
apps you have on that phone that you can justify the use of that you
can't update?
I ran into an app used for blocking spam calls. It had a name. When I
went to a new phone with a later Android version, the app "updated"
itself by installing a DIFFERENT app. Turned out the old app didn't
support the later Android version, so the "update" was to foist upon me
a different app (by the same company) that supported later Android
versions. I couldn't get the old app installed after uninstalling the
"update" to a different app.

Don't remember the old app's name, but it was made by the same company
(Hiya) that also came out with the Hiya app. I think Hiya's
recommendation was to go with their Mr. Number app that gave me some
feature in the old app that would not support the later Android version.
They dropped the old app, and had its "update" move me to their new Hiya
app which was missing something that they said was in their Mr. Number
app. My recollection is this way way back when I was using Android
4.4.3 and move to Android 5 or 6.

Things change. I now read Mr. Number is their premium (paid) service,
so if I was still using Mr Number then I'd have to pay for it.

https://hiyahelp.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115015333847-Mr-Number-FAQ-Android

For Mr Number app users that want to continue using a free service, now
they recommended moving to their Hiya app. Old app won't support a
later OS version, had to switch to Hiya, something missing, so went to
their Mr Number app, and now they charge for Mr Number, so would have to
go back to Hiya app. I dumped using an anti-spam call app awhile ago.

Sorry, I cannot justify any app as critical to my existence. Even a
smartphone is not critical. To me, it is a convenience. Yep, I use
Google Maps now, but long ago I had a $15 wire-spiral bound map book
that covered my city in detail (versus those fold-up travel maps). You
bought them by city. Fit just right into the door panel pocket. Nope,
the map book was not critical. Google Maps is also not critical. I
could get by with a dumb phone. For a long time, I never carried a
phone. I survived.

Depends on how you justify what you want versus what you really need.
SC Tom
2021-10-29 12:06:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Goodfellow
Can you name a single Android app you use that you can't update?
In a recent thread, The Real Bev mentioned the possibility of apps that
can't be updated because the Android device was purportedly "too old."
Yet, it's my understanding that Google has been updating its core Android
apps for over 8 years (last we discussed this), so the phone has to be
_really_ (really!) old for it to not have the apps updatable, right?
Admittedly Android updates for 8 years is a bit old for a smartphone, so
let's try to limit this to something reasonable like Android 7 & up.
Android 7.0 was released August 22nd, 2016 so that's about five years.
If your phone is Android 7 & above, may I ask you to tell us which apps you
have on that phone that you can justify the use of that you can't update?
I have been using an app called "Sat Orientation" for a number of Android
versions until I bought a Samsung Tab S7 with Android 11. It wouldn't
install the app from the Play store, so I dl'd the APK and installed it. It
doesn't update, but works just fine.
--
SC Tom
Allodoxaphobia
2021-10-29 15:45:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Goodfellow
Can you name a single Android app you use that you can't update?
juiceSSH

But, I feel no burning need to get it updated.
IJFW for what I need to do.
The Real Bev
2021-10-29 18:49:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Allodoxaphobia
Post by Robin Goodfellow
Can you name a single Android app you use that you can't update?
juiceSSH
But, I feel no burning need to get it updated.
IJFW for what I need to do.
ES File Explorer, which google has removed due to its [supposed] use as
a spying tool by the Chinese. It's the best file manager I tried; if
China regards the information on my phone as a fair price for giving me
this nifty tool, I'm OK with that.
I have to go to their website and update it manually, which I've done
ONCE in the year and a half that I've had this phone.
Does anyone here REALLY know anything about the nefarious exploits of ESFE?
I trialed ES Explorer for a very short time. Very nice tool, but very
nasty adware. I'd use it, close it, continue using my phone, and
suddenly a fullscreen ad appeared. I couldn't use my phone until I
closed the fullscreen ad (it obliterated the screen, so no access to any
icons or anything in the Android screen). I knew enough to never use
the "X" or "Close" button present by an ad since that can run a script
rather than ask the OS to close the window. I used the Back button in
the Android navbar to get rid of the ad. After this happened several
times, I started to investigate what asshole was puking out fullscreen
ads that were interfering with access and use of my phone. It was ES
Explorer, so it got dumped.
Some of the fullscreen ads even tried to misrepresent their content by
trying to present button objects that mirrored the ones in the Android
navbar. They wanted you to tap on their fake navbar buttons to run
their script or take you somewhere. My Android navbar is configured to
/not/ auto-hide, so I'd see both the ads fake navbar buttons and the
Android's true navbar buttons.
I haven't looked carefully at the stuff that pops up, I just do what I
need to do to get rid of it. Maybe just wait for it to go away...
I used Droid Optimizer to kill backgrounded apps to find when the
fullscreen ad disappeared. This showed which app was interferring with
access and use of my smartphone when it got killed and the fullscreen ad
disappeared. After uninstalling E's Shitty Exploder, no more fullscreen
ads popping up to obliterate the Android screen.
Does this actually kill running apps? It shows you a list and offers
instant death to those you choose? I'll give it a try.
These fullscreen ads only appeared when ES Explorer was backgrounded.
They didn't want those interfering ads to interfere with you using their
app. Could be minutes or hours before the fullscreen ad appeared, so
you'd forget you had used ES Explorer.
I use it and then flick it away. If I call it up from its own icon I
get some full-screen Chinese crap, which goes away. I hardly ever need
to do that.

I made two 'shortcuts' on a home screen -- one for the DCIM/camera
subdirectory and one for /000 on my computer. Tap first one, select
ALL, tap copy, open new home page, tap /000, tap paste, shut down ESF
screens by flicking upward. No ads.
--
Cheers, Bev
...so few snipers, so many politicians...
VanguardLH
2021-10-29 20:23:26 UTC
Permalink
Does [Droid Optimizer] actually kill running apps? It shows you a
list and offers instant death to those you choose? I'll give it a
try.
Yep. You tap on the circle showing memory usage. A list of background
apps is listed (user and system). You tap on an icon for an app. Alas,
just an icon, so you have to know hieroglyphics to know for which app
the icon represents. Once you tap on an app icon, a panel shows up
giving more info. Use the X button to kill the app. Or, configure its
whitelist for apps you don't want killed, and use the app or its widget
to kill all the non-whitelisted apps.

Not all apps can be killed. For example, Droid Optimizer will not kill
itself which is obvious why not. Some apps are designated as "sticky":
they not only load when you start the OS, but they request the OS to
reload them should the OS notice they aren't running anymore. You kill
them, but the OS reloads them. That's why some task killing app users
complain that they cannot kill an app. It's privileged or its sticky.
In addition, there are services that will load apps.

When I had the Hangouts + Hangouts Dialer apps, I wanted the Hangouts
app whitelisted, so it wouldn't get killed when I use Droid Optimizer
1-touch kill button. Hangouts kept getting killed anyway. That's
because the ancilliary Hangouts Dialer app was not shown in the app list
to included in the whitelist - until I change to listing showing System
apps (instead of User apps), or listing All apps. Then I could see the
Hangouts Dialer app to add it and the Hangouts app to the whitelist, and
that kept Droid Optimizer from killing Hangouts with I used its widget
to do the 1-touch kill.

While they have a widget you can put on an Android screen, it works when
you tap on it, but it no longer refreshes to show the current memory
usage level. Supposedly it can be configured to refresh (to show the
current memory usage) at 1, 5, 15, 30, 45, and 60 minute intervals.
Nope, awhile ago it stopped refreshing to show the current memory usage
(which hinted to me when I might want to tap the widget to kill all the
non-whitelisted apps). It refreshes when I tap the widget to do the
cleanup, but I'd like to see the memory usage before I tap the widget.
Typically I'm never more than 30% consumption of my 4 GB of RAM.

It has some battery info, too, like charge level (and if discharging or
charging), battery temperature, battery voltage, and when was the last
charging session.

Another feature is cleaning the file system, like the junk/temp folder.
It can only clean out the public caches. Android's security bars one
app from clearing another app's private cache. It also has a startup
manager. It doesn't delete or disable a startup app, but it can kill
startup apps you don't want (stop on boot).

It has an app manager which will show more than the user-installed apps.
It will show the system and hidden apps that you won't see in Android's
settings -> Apps. You can list by type: All, User, System, Running,
Whitelisted, On SD-Card (apps you moved to the SD card), On internal
storage, and those that were Disabled or Frozen.

It has an automatic (scheduled) cleanup function. It can be schedule to
run at periodic intervals, or at specified times on specified days and
optionally only when the screen is switched off. Not scheduled at a
particular time, like when you sleep, but repeated at an interval you
specify. I have it configured for 1-hour intervals to flush background
apps while using its whitelist, but to clean the public caches or to
delete selected folders. However, I also have it deactivated since I'm
really not interested in this feature.

It has a privacy feature that looks at app permissions. One attribute I
like about this feature is picking an app shows me when it was installed
(and when it was last updated) - but I sure wish they'd pick a different
color than bright red on black, and why I cannot use its dark mode to
instead show as bright red on white. While it may list a lot of apps as
suspicious, it's still up to know which permissions an app really does
need. It will note Google's Messages app as having "Send SMS/MMS"
permission. Well, yeah, it's a messaging app, so it needs this
permission to do its job. You can tap the More Info button when viewing
an app's permissions to get a little more details on the permissions.
No idea why it often shows duplicates for the same permission, like
showing "Download without notification" for the Kindle app, so maybe
there are different categories of permissions under which each had a
download permission, or the app is getting confused reading permissions.
It shows the list of permissions by description, but also lists them by
Android permission attributes. Those show you tons more permissions
than you ever get prompted to allow, but you'll have to lookup the
android.permission.<attribute> permissions to understand what each is
for. It will also show all the services on which the app depends.

It is adware which I usually try to avoid; however, it doesn't show ads
by itself nor are there ad banners polluting it GUI. Only if you click
on "More apps" does it show more apps offered by this app's author
(Ashampoo), like Droid Commander, a file manager (I use Total Commander
which is less of a boob GUI design, or a more techy GUI).
I use it and then flick it away. If I call it up from its own icon I
get some full-screen Chinese crap, which goes away. I hardly ever need
to do that.
I was at a dentist checking my calender when making the next
appointment. That day was do the exam and schedule the work for a week,
or two, away. I wanted to look at my calendar, but the damn fullscreen
ad got in the way of me using my phone, and there was a problem getting
rid of the ad (at the time, I might've been new to this backgrounded app
shoving fullscreen ads in my face which obliterated the Android's
screens). Rather than have the receptionist sit there waiting for me to
figure out how to use my phone, I told her to go ahead to make an
appointement, and I'd call back later if there was a scheduling
conflict.
The Real Bev
2021-10-30 15:22:45 UTC
Permalink
My son is a Hangouts addict, so I started using it. Now I resent
people who DON'T use it :-( I don't see any reason to kill either
HO or Google Voice, the Dialer's replacement. I looked at that piece
of crap that replaces HO itself and just added that to the shitpile
of annoyance google already causes :-(
Don't know when you started using Hangouts.
2 years ago. The skinny format on my computer is easy to read just like
2-column printing is easy to read. BTW, I was amazed to discover that
printing in 2 columns uses less space than single-column printing. More
efficient use of hyphenation...
Google is discontinuing
Hangouts (and its dialer ancilliary app) to move to Chat (no dialer, as
I recall, just a chat app) and Meet for online conferences. Chat
targets end users. Meet mostly targets business users for video
conferencing.
I looked at chat on my computer. It's really a bitch to read long
lines, especially if people don't separate stuff into paragraphs.
Haven't looked at it on the phone -- I'm afraid I won't be able to get back.
https://techcrunch.com/2020/10/15/hangouts-meet-chat/
https://support.google.com/chat/answer/7653601?hl=en&co=GENIE.Platform%3DAndroid
https://apps.google.com/meet/
Hangouts is going away. All hail Chat and Meet.
Meet/zoom/whatever is kind of irrelevant -- I use it so infrequently
that it doesn't really matter.
I've used Google Voice (GV_ as a pbx to all my phones for a few years
now. However, there is speculation that GV will go away, because it
competes with Google's Fi paid service (https://fi.google.com/about/).
To me, gFi looks more like yet another endpoint carrier service rather
than the PBX services afforded by GV across multiple phones.
you could use one of the other, but not both. You can integrate the
two, but it doesn't yet look like gFI usurps what GV does.
I like Hangouts dialer for wifi calls to random numbers when I have
hotspot access outside my home. Is there another wifi phone app that
doesn't require your callees to be using the same app?
Down to the GV and e-mail apps
telling me about new texts. I could disable e-mail forwarding of texts
in my GV account, but I wouldn't see my e-mail apps on my desktops
telling me of new texts.
The transcripts were always weird. That's strange because I've started
using my voice instead of 'typing' on the Pixel2 and I'm amazed at how
accurate it is. It's SOOOO much better than typing.
AND it allows F degrees. We holdouts have no idea how cold/hot C
degrees are.
While I've done plenty of PC builds to get a feel of how hot or how cold
is a Celsius reading, I still prefer Fahrenheit since that's what I grew
up using. Your religion is likely the same as your parents. Your
language is what you grew up using. Whether you prefer metric or
imperial for measurement depends on what you grew up using.
Yes. When I took chemistry in HS and college I got used to metric
measurements, but those have been lost in time... For a while gas was
being sold by the liter here, and I really hated that. I KNEW what a
good price for gas was by the gallon, but not by the liter. I figured
that the stations knew we were all confused and tacked on quite a bit to
the price. REALLY glad that went away. I still hate paying $4.25 for
gas because it's too big a nuisance to drive to Costco for $3.97.
Fortunately I don't have to fill up very often -- last time was 2 months
between! I feel really sorry for people with long commutes.
My REAL calendar is a tcl/tk thing using the reminder program on my
computer.
But what do you use for calendaring at the same place you'd be using the
ES Explorer app that was being discussed? ES Explorer won't be showing
interferring fullscreen ads on your computer, only on your smartphone.
ESE has a calendar? And a linux app? Who knew? I can barely read the
Jorte entries and I hate trying to type a new one in when I can just
write something on a piece of paper in a few seconds.
I also have a paper 2-year calendar in my purse for writing down
appointments until I can type them into my REAL computer.
I lug around my smartphone with its apps to use them, not to rely on a
piece of paper getting worn, wet, or damaged in my pocket. When at
home, I use an app for calendaring that syncs with the same calender on
my other devices. When away from home, I use a calendaring app on my
phone that syncs with the same calendar accessed on all my other
devices. Having to write anything on a piece of paper to wait until I
get home to add an event to my calendar (assuming I remember there's a
paper calendar in my back pocket) defeats the point of having your
smartphone with you.
Mine is mainly a camera and a map.

I paired the thing to my car radio, which was painless. The other day
my phone (in my purse) rang on the radio and a little green phone symbol
appeared. Wow. REALLY handy. Unfortunately talking to the windshield
is still too distracting so I told my friend I'd call him back when I
got home. Still, it's really slick. Daughter, who lives on her phone,
does it all the time without mishap so I guess you can get used to it,
but probably not on a once-a-year basis :-(
I wear pants and a belt. The pockets and belt holsters are my purse. I
have no interest in, ahem, marring "my lines". My pockets buldge (okay,
skip the pun retorts), and I have anywhere from 1 to 4 holsters holding
stuff on my belt. If I'm out, I have my smartphone in a belt holster.
I see no good reason to tote a bunch of duplicating accoutrements when I
have a perfectly good smartphone to use.
I use a fanny pack (no jokes from the Brits among us!) when I just want
to carry my wallet, keys, phone and maybe a small water bottle. And a
Swiss army knife. And some plastic baggies in case I want to steal some
seeds or cuttings. And a snack...

I have a BIG fanny pack :-(
Also, I paid for the phone, it's my property, and no app will interfere
with my use of my phone by spewing out fullscreen ads that obliterate
access to the phone's screens. I don't waste time on rude and
interfering apps. You may be more tolerant than I by enduring the ads,
but I'll prevent or kill them from interfering with use of my property.
It hasn't been troublesome the way I use it. I can avoid the ads by
starting it from the /DCIM/camera ikon.

I had hoped that your Droid Optimizer would decrease battery usage, but
so far I see no difference. I kill everything every once in a while,
but it doesn't seem to help.
--
Cheers, Bev
"I can't stand this proliferation of paperwork. It's useless to
fight the forms. You've got to kill the people producing them."
-- Vladimir Kabaidze
VanguardLH
2021-10-31 00:41:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Real Bev
Meet/zoom/whatever is kind of irrelevant -- I use it so infrequently
that it doesn't really matter.
You said you love Hangouts. I pointed out it is going away.
Post by The Real Bev
My REAL calendar is a tcl/tk thing using the reminder program on my
computer.
But what do you use for calendaring at the same place you'd be using the
ES Explorer app that was being discussed? ES Explorer won't be showing
interferring fullscreen ads on your computer, only on your smartphone.
ESE has a calendar? And a linux app? Who knew? I can barely read the
Jorte entries and I hate trying to type a new one in when I can just
write something on a piece of paper in a few seconds.
Since ES Explorer came up, my argument was about it interfering with the
use of my phone due to its fullscreen ads. ES Explorer only runs on a
smartphone, not on your computer. So, you brought in a platform where
ES Explore could never cause interference, because it won't ever be on
that non-phone platform. To be discussing ES Explorer means you are
talking about a smartphone, not your desktop PC.

For ES Explorer, which is only on my smartphone, and while ES Explorer
was still loaded (foreground or background), it puked fullscreen ads
that obliterated access to the phone's screens. I gave calendering as
just one example of something I wanted to do, but fullscreen ads
interferred with me getting at the calendar. Couldn't been I wanted to
use QuickMemo+, Network Cell Info, Outlook or other e-mail app, or any
app. I couldn't get to any app because the fullscreen ad prevented me
from using my phone.

Yep, in the example, I had the receptionist go ahead and make an
appointment, because I couldn't get at the Calendar app, or any other
app, due to ES Explorer's interference. I did use a piece of paper:
their business card upon which I wrote the date of the appointment, and,
like you, later added the appointment to my calendar. I had to make the
appointment blind since I couldn't look at my calendar. If I had wanted
to use a text editor, I wouldn't have been able to use that app, either.
About the time when the receptionist setup the appointment, and after
writing it on a piece of paper, was when I figured out how to get passed
the fullscreen ad without clicking on any part of it.

ES Explorer via its fullscreen ads was rude and corruptive to my use of
my phone for HOWEVER I wanted to use my phone. In fact, I'd be in
middle of something, bang, a fullscreen ad appeared, I'd have to get rid
of without touching it, and could continue my work. Would you like
someone cutting into your call with an add, and not until you got them
off the line could you continue with the call?
Post by The Real Bev
It hasn't been troublesome the way I use it. I can avoid the ads by
starting it from the /DCIM/camera ikon.
If an app shows fullscreen ads, doesn't matter which folder it is
currently listing. It's the program that shows the ads, not the
phone+folder as a trigger.

Since my trial of ES Explorer was around 4 years ago, could be its owner
atoned for their shitty behavior. They have certainly changed their
name often enough trying to shed that old reputation.
AJL
2021-10-31 01:51:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by VanguardLH
Since my trial of ES Explorer was around 4 years ago, could be its
owner atoned for their shitty behavior. They have certainly changed
their name often enough trying to shed that old reputation.
The "About Us" screen of my old version 1.6.0.8 of ES File Explorer says
"Copyright 2011, EStrongs Inc". The site given is www.estrongs.com.

That site is still in service in English. But if you push the App Store
button you get a Chinese page giving "Beijing Xiaoxiong Bowang
Technology Co., Ltd" as the author. And if you push the Android button
it's back in English and you can download (maybe, I didn't try) version
4.2.6.2.1. with "ES App Group" as the author. But the ES App Group link
further down the page times out. The page also says 130 million
downloads so guess it was popular. Also says 4.2.6.2.1 works with
Android 1.6 and up. Old site and out of date?

BTW the reason my old ET version won't work with newer versions of
Android is because (like the Groundhog newsreader) the 3 dot menu icon
is located on the bottom right of the navigation bar. For some reason it
disappears in newer Android versions. It makes Groundhog a reader only
newsreader and ET unusable...
VanguardLH
2021-10-31 04:49:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by AJL
The "About Us" screen of my old version 1.6.0.8 of ES File Explorer
says "Copyright 2011, EStrongs Inc". The site given is
www.estrongs.com.
That site is still in service in English. But if you push the App
Store button you get a Chinese page giving "Beijing Xiaoxiong Bowang
Technology Co., Ltd" as the author.
https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:heJi2HpIT_gJ:https://www.yicaiglobal.com/news/baidu-to-unload-its-mobile-ad-platform-for-developers-to-set-up-new-ai-driven-company+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
(Original page no longer available on Baidu's server)

Baidu is the dominant online search engine service in China. The above
might explain some of the numerous name changes on the app owner/author.
Back when I trialed it, the app author/owner was DU Group.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ES_File_Explorer
"ES File Explorer was removed from the Google Play Store in April 2019,
along with several other apps created by DO Global (formerly DU Group)."

That's just over 2 years ago, so not long ago.

"It was claimed the company who owns ES File Explorer, DO Global, was
committing 'click fraud' by clicking ads in users' apps in the
background without permission."

No app should be able to drill into another app to commit actions inside
the other app. That's definitely a security breach. They couldn't get
enough click-through revenue with their app's ads, so they tried to get
click-through revenue through ads in other apps. They were doing this
in the background, so users wouldn't see the malicious behavior. Geesh.
DO Global's (the company name then identified as the app's owner/author)
response is shown at:

https://troypoint.com/es-file-explorer-removed-from-google-play-store/

So, they're claiming "It's not our fault. It's the fault of what we
chose to incorporate in our product." Uh huh. Users don't care whose
libs or code your employ inside your product. It's your product. It's
your fault. Considering their past use of fullscreen ads usurping
control of the phone, it's more about them getting caught then somehow
they were ignorant of what code they used in their product. The old
excuse of "it's not illegal if you're not caught".

Others have noted not getting impacted by screen hijacking fullscreen
ads, so they probably gave up on that untoward behavior. However, the
wiki says:

"Though ES File Explorer had originally been a freeware program, the app
later converted into shareware. It began charging a monthly $9.99 fee in
order to use its more advanced features, towards the end of 2019."

It was freeware back when I trialed it. When you visit the Amazon page
(https://www.amazon.com/ES-File-Explorer-Manager/dp/B008K6HN8I/), it
looks to be free until you realize "Free Download" doesn't mean "Free".
Don't know of anywhere you pay for the download. Well, unless getting
the download requires subscribing to their content: download is "free",
but access is not. So, the app store copy you get that is "free" is
actually crippleware?

At the Amazon app page for ES File Explorer, there's a link to see the
app's permissions.

Open network sockets
Oh yeah, it's adware. Needs to get its ads. I noticed it also
includes cloud storage feature. I don't need another OneDrive, Google
Drive, Dropbox, or other online storage service, especially in what is
supposed to be a file manager. Considering the "shareware" note
below, I'm guessing cloud storage is not in the "free" crippleware
version. I prefer configuring a best-of-breed setup. I use a
filet knife after fishing, not multi-tool. When Acronis got bloated
with extraneous functions (which were hard to disable or remove), I
found something else.

Allows termination of background processes
ES Explorer is a process killer, too?

Set the wallpaper
WTF? It's a file manager. Not a tweaker.

Allows sending in-app billing requests and managing in-app billing
transactions
Lends credence to the wiki article saying this app went to shareware.

Allows an application to receive messages via Google Cloud Messaging
See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Cloud_Messaging. The app
phones home.

Open windows using the type TYPE_SYSTEM_ALERT, shown on top of all other
applications
When using the app, why doesn't it show its content in its own screen.
If I want to do something else, I don't want it stepping on my using
some other app. This is supposed to be a file manager, not an
overseer.

Access the vibration feature
Does this app have a service counterpart that is always running, so it
could issue alerts about, say, running out of storage space?

ACCESS_SUPERUSER
Deprecated since Android 5.0. Grants root access to an app without
any GUI interaction. Wouldn't this permission require rooting of the
smartphone (to use SU mode)?

Clear the caches of all installed applications on the device
Android bars any app from clearing /private/ caches of another app.
Apps can only flush the public caches.

Access the list of accounts in the Accounts Service
Hmm, if I'm using a file manager, it should only need to see what my
account, and only account, can see.

PowerManager WakeLocks to keep processor from sleeping or screen from
dimming
While using the app, it can prevent low-power modes, and eat up your
battery. Why would a file manager require controlling the screen?

There are some other suspicious permissions. Wow, I thought this was a
file manager. Digs deeper and usurps more control than I would expect
of a file manager.

From the product description, "Perfect streaming function: support
direct playback of music and movies on network devices". Why would I
want a /file manager/ to be a streaming server? There is so much bloat
in this app that it looks like the owner/author was tossing in anything
trying to garner a customerbase. Loss of direction.
AJL
2021-10-30 01:35:25 UTC
Permalink
ES File Explorer, which google has removed due to its [supposed]
use as a spying tool by the Chinese. It's the best file manager I
tried; if China regards the information on my phone as a fair
price for giving me this nifty tool, I'm OK with that.
I have to go to their website and update it manually, which I've
done ONCE in the year and a half that I've had this phone.
The Amazon Appstore still has it so apparently not all the biggies
think it's bad...
Out of curiosity I downloaded ES File Explorer File Manager (ES Mobile)
from the Amazon Appstore to one of my Amazon Fire tablets. While using
it I've seen no ads other than a small icon (top right corner) and a
banner on top of the settings screen wanting me to upgrade to a paid
version. Also some of the functions like Space Analyzer and Cleaner
won't work and take me to an upgrade page. Most everything else seems
to work fine, even the music player. It says its version 4.2.1.2.a.

BTW if anyone ever wants to use the Amazon Appstore on their non-Amazon
device it can be downloaded. Google for instructions...
AJL
2021-10-30 02:42:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by AJL
ES File Explorer, which google has removed due to its [supposed]
use as a spying tool by the Chinese. It's the best file manager
I tried; if China regards the information on my phone as a fair
price for giving me this nifty tool, I'm OK with that.
I have to go to their website and update it manually, which I've
done ONCE in the year and a half that I've had this phone.
The Amazon Appstore still has it so apparently not all the biggies
think it's bad...
Out of curiosity I downloaded ES File Explorer File Manager (ES
Mobile) from the Amazon Appstore to one of my Amazon Fire tablets.
While using it I've seen no ads other than a small icon (top right
corner) and a banner on top of the settings screen wanting me to
upgrade to a paid version. Also some of the functions like Space
Analyzer and Cleaner won't work and take me to an upgrade page. Most
everything else seems to work fine, even the music player. It says
its version 4.2.1.2.a.
BTW if anyone ever wants to use the Amazon Appstore on their
non-Amazon device it can be downloaded. Google for instructions...
I had a several year old version of ES File Explorer stored in my apk
files but when I tried it on my Android 11 phone, though it loaded and
ran, it was missing too much and was unusable.

So I thought why not and put the Amazon Appstore on my phone. Then
downloaded the same ES File Explorer app. Works on my phone just like on
the Amazon tablet. So will play with it awhile. The adventure continues.
Thanks Bev...
AJL
2021-10-30 21:17:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by AJL
I had a several year old version of ES File Explorer stored in my apk
files but when I tried it on my Android 11 phone, though it loaded
and ran, it was unusable.
In my continuing quest for superior knowledge (and having too much free
time) I loaded my several year old apk copy of ES File Explorer (version
1.6.0.8) onto my Amazon Fire tablet (Fire OS 7.3.2.1 based on Android
9), and unlike my Android 11 phone, the app worked fine. But boy what a
letdown. It is very very basic, nothing like today's version, and
somewhat disappointing. I wonder why I liked it enough to save it at the
time? Probably to avoid future ads and paid upgrades. Well I did...
VanguardLH
2021-10-30 07:20:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by AJL
Out of curiosity I downloaded ES File Explorer File Manager (ES
Mobile) from the Amazon Appstore to one of my Amazon Fire tablets.
While using it I've seen no ads other than a small icon (top right
corner) and a banner on top of the settings screen wanting me to
upgrade to a paid version. Also some of the functions like Space
Analyzer and Cleaner won't work and take me to an upgrade page. Most
everything else seems to work fine, even the music player. It says
its version 4.2.1.2.a.
I searched the Amazon app store on "es explorer". I found ES File
Explorer File Manager, but that's not the same name of ES Explorer that
I trialed before (about 4 years ago). At some point, the app author
added "File" to the app name.

https://www.amazon.com/ES-File-Explorer-Manager/dp/B008K6HN8I/
(a highly shortened version of Amazon's huge tracking URL)

That's the first one that was a close hit. Per the above link, the app
author is ES Mobile. I don't remember that app author name. Back when
I trialed ES Explorer, the app author was called DO Global, or maybe DU
Group (DU Group became DO Global).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ES_File_Explorer

Geez, no wonder Google dropped this app. A rose by any other name would
smell as sweet. A turd by any other name would still smell bad.

"ES Global, subsidiary of DO Global", but the Amazon app page says the
author is ES Mobile. Looks like they're switching name tags hoping no
one now remembers who they were before.

When I click on "Contact developer" link at the Amazon app page, the
contacts point to estrongs.com. The wiki articles points to
estrongs.com as the web site for ES File Explorer.

Baidu -> DO Global (nee DU Group) -> ES Global -> ES Mobile ->
estrongs.com (ES APP Group)

I cannot be sure that is the hierarchy of subsidiaries or affiliates.
The companies or business names are a mess. Everytime you look, they're
wearing a different mask.

Since the 4 years when I trialed ES Explorer (not ES File Explorer), the
app author might've atoned their sins, and removed their crap. This is
Chinaware that gives a bad reputation to other Chinaware.
Frank Slootweg
2021-10-30 17:33:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by VanguardLH
Post by AJL
Out of curiosity I downloaded ES File Explorer File Manager (ES
Mobile) from the Amazon Appstore to one of my Amazon Fire tablets.
While using it I've seen no ads other than a small icon (top right
corner) and a banner on top of the settings screen wanting me to
upgrade to a paid version. Also some of the functions like Space
Analyzer and Cleaner won't work and take me to an upgrade page. Most
everything else seems to work fine, even the music player. It says
its version 4.2.1.2.a.
I searched the Amazon app store on "es explorer". I found ES File
Explorer File Manager, but that's not the same name of ES Explorer that
I trialed before (about 4 years ago). At some point, the app author
added "File" to the app name.
https://www.amazon.com/ES-File-Explorer-Manager/dp/B008K6HN8I/
(a highly shortened version of Amazon's huge tracking URL)
That's the first one that was a close hit. Per the above link, the app
author is ES Mobile. I don't remember that app author name. Back when
I trialed ES Explorer, the app author was called DO Global, or maybe DU
Group (DU Group became DO Global).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ES_File_Explorer
Geez, no wonder Google dropped this app. A rose by any other name would
smell as sweet. A turd by any other name would still smell bad.
"ES Global, subsidiary of DO Global", but the Amazon app page says the
author is ES Mobile. Looks like they're switching name tags hoping no
one now remembers who they were before.
When I click on "Contact developer" link at the Amazon app page, the
contacts point to estrongs.com. The wiki articles points to
estrongs.com as the web site for ES File Explorer.
Yes, estrongs.com is the common factor. All other things like the
app's name, its developer, etc. are rather meaningless.

It would be interesting to know what the \Android\data\... path of the
Amazon app is. As I wrote before, for the original Google Play app and
for the current app on estrongs.com, it's com.estrongs.android.pop.

(As I happened to find out yesterday,) One can no longer look inside
\Android\data, at least I can't on my Samsung Galaxy A51 phone with
Android 11 (I assume it was the same on Android 10). The \Android folder
has a gear icon in its folder icon and when you go to \Android\data, it
shows nothing and says 'No files'.

But my trusty 'Apk Extractor', still shows the path for the current
estrongs.com version as com.estrongs.android.pop.

('Apk Extractor (marga)'
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.marga.ApkDownloader>)
Post by VanguardLH
Baidu -> DO Global (nee DU Group) -> ES Global -> ES Mobile ->
estrongs.com (ES APP Group)
I cannot be sure that is the hierarchy of subsidiaries or affiliates.
The companies or business names are a mess. Everytime you look, they're
wearing a different mask.
Since the 4 years when I trialed ES Explorer (not ES File Explorer), the
app author might've atoned their sins, and removed their crap. This is
Chinaware that gives a bad reputation to other Chinaware.
Indeed. I'm about to uninstall my copy of "ES File Explorer" - which
is the one which was updated to the one on the estrongs.com website
- and try some alternative.

May be I'll try the (new) Google Play blessed version I mentioned
before:

'EStrongs file explorer | file manager'
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.estrongs.esfile.explorer>

But while that version implicitly references estrongs.com, the Google
Play entry doesn't mention a website and only gives a gmail.com e-mail
address for the Developer, so still a bit smelly.
Frank Slootweg
2021-10-31 13:35:37 UTC
Permalink
Yesterday, I wrote:
[...]
Post by Frank Slootweg
It would be interesting to know what the \Android\data\... path of the
Amazon app is. As I wrote before, for the original Google Play app and
for the current app on estrongs.com, it's com.estrongs.android.pop.
(As I happened to find out yesterday,) One can no longer look inside
\Android\data, at least I can't on my Samsung Galaxy A51 phone with
Android 11 (I assume it was the same on Android 10). The \Android folder
has a gear icon in its folder icon and when you go to \Android\data, it
shows nothing and says 'No files'.
But my trusty 'Apk Extractor', still shows the path for the current
estrongs.com version as com.estrongs.android.pop.
In case anyone else wonders about this no access to \Android\data:

I USB-connected my phone to my Windows (8.1) computer and (Windows)
File Explorer *does* have access to/inside/below \Android\data.

So that is a a way to access this folder, without having to resort to
(potentially) 'tricky' apps on the Android side.

N.B. I was wondering about this issue, because how can you make backup
of your Android device [1] if this (and other?) folder(s) is/are not
accessible?

[1] FWIW, I've given up trying to make backup of my Android devices. Way
too much effort and no full backup/restore procedures anyway. Only the
most 'essential' stuff is backed up.

[...]
Ken Blake
2021-10-31 16:29:34 UTC
Permalink
But... When the wife gets a new iPhone (by mail) I like the way I can
just sit it next to the old one and transfer everything, making using
the new one (almost) identical for her. That's good because I'm all
thumbs when it comes to iStuff. I currently have a spare iPhone and iPad
in the drawer but get frustrated trying to do stuff I do on my Android
toys. I'm sure it must be me... :-/
For a while now, I've wondered why there was an "i" in the names, and
what the "i" stands for, but I never bothered to look it up. I just did.
For anyone who doesn't know and is interested,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMac says

"Ken Segall was an employee at an L.A. ad agency handling Apple's
account who came up with the name "iMac" and pitched it to Steve Jobs.
After Jobs' death, Segall claimed Jobs preferred "MacMan" for the name
of the computer, but after Segall pitched "iMac" to him twice, the name
was accepted. Segall says that the "i" stands for "Internet", but also
represents the product as a personal and revolutionary device ('i' for
"individuality" and "innovation"). Apple later adopted the 'i' prefix
across its consumer hardware and software lines, such as iPod, iBook
(later MacBook), iPhone, iPad and various pieces of software such as the
iLife suite and iWork and the company's media player/store."
--
Ken
Frank Slootweg
2021-10-30 17:55:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by VanguardLH
Post by AJL
Out of curiosity I downloaded ES File Explorer File Manager (ES
Mobile) from the Amazon Appstore to one of my Amazon Fire tablets.
While using it I've seen no ads other than a small icon (top right
corner) and a banner on top of the settings screen wanting me to
upgrade to a paid version. Also some of the functions like Space
Analyzer and Cleaner won't work and take me to an upgrade page.
Most everything else seems to work fine, even the music player. It
says its version 4.2.1.2.a.
I searched the Amazon app store on "es explorer". I found ES File
Explorer File Manager, but that's not the same name of ES Explorer
that I trialed before (about 4 years ago). At some point, the app
author added "File" to the app name.
https://www.amazon.com/ES-File-Explorer-Manager/dp/B008K6HN8I/ (a
highly shortened version of Amazon's huge tracking URL)
Yup. That's the one I downloaded. The Amazon's full name is ES File
Explorer File Manager (by ES Mobile) but the downloaded app just says ES
File Explorer.
Post by VanguardLH
That's the first one that was a close hit. Per the above link, the
app author is ES Mobile. I don't remember that app author name.
Back when I trialed ES Explorer, the app author was called DO Global,
or maybe DU Group (DU Group became DO Global).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ES_File_Explorer
That's the same app. The logo is the same as Amazon's and the link says
the original author is ES Mobile. Amazon is using an older version. Many
of their apps are older versions than those found in the Play Store. My
GUESS is because their Fire OS is a fork of an older version of Android.
I think it's not so much "an older version", but a branch/fork/
<whatever> of a long standing app, because the version number you
mention - 4.2.1.2.a - for the Amazon version is close to the version
number 4.2.6.2.1 of the latest and (not so) greatest version which can
be downloaded from (via) the estrongs.com website.

[...]
Anything to make a buck. At least there are no full screen ads. So guess
I'll delete it and go back to (gasp) Google Files...
Is Google Files [1] any_good/reasonable?

Currently I have the bundled Samsung's 'My Files' and the crept-in
non-Google_Play "ES File Explorer" from the estrongs.com site and I
would like to dump the latter.

[1] I assume you mean:
'Files by Google' (Google LLC)
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.google.android.apps.nbu.files>
AJL
2021-10-30 20:15:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Frank Slootweg
So guess ... I'll go back to (gasp) Google Files...
Is Google Files [1] any_good/reasonable?
I suppose it depends on what you want. It works for me. It has an
encrypted safe folder that can be locked. Also a few cleaning tools like
cleaning junk files, deleting duplicates, etc, and...deleting blurry
photos (I am not kidding)...
Post by Frank Slootweg
Currently I have the bundled Samsung's 'My Files'
I have that too. Came with my phone.
Post by Frank Slootweg
and the crept-in non-Google_Play "ES File Explorer" from the
estrongs.com site and I would like to dump the latter.
My Google Files app also says Google Play Protect is on and further says
it scans my files for harmful apps. But it never said boo about my
nasty recently downloaded ES app...
Post by Frank Slootweg
[1] I assume you mean: 'Files by Google' (Google LLC)
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.google.android.apps.nbu.files>
Yes that's the one. I forgot its real name. Its icon just says "Files".
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