Google's "Find My Debvice Network"

[Stan Brown]

I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

Everything I could find told me to make settings changes in the Find
My Device app, but I don't have that app. Does that mean I'm not part
of the network, or do I need to install an app I don't want just to
opt out of a network I don't want?

[Andy Burns]

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

Is it actually live yet?

Post by Stan Brown
Everything I could find told me to make settings changes in the Find
My Device app, but I don't have that app. Does that mean I'm not part
of the network, or do I need to install an app I don't want just to
opt out of a network I don't want?

I've had the Find My Device app installed for years (before the recent
capabilities)

The settings within the app only control whether my device(s) can be
found, not whether they participate in finding anyone else's devices.

Turn off bluetooth?

[Jörg Lorenz]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

Is it actually live yet?

At least since 2020.

If you speak a little bit of German than you can see how easy it is to
turn it on and to turn it off again:

https://www.heise.de/tipps-tricks/Google-Find-my-Device-so-funktioniert-s-6202798.html

or open settings. Go to search function and enter "find my" and enter.
There you are! Deactivate it!

[Andy Burns]

Post by Jörg Lorenz

Post by Andy Burns
Is it actually live yet?

At least since 2020.

That's old news, but there's a new finder, only been around (even in
beta) a month or so ...

<https://

[Jörg Lorenz]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Jörg Lorenz

Post by Andy Burns
Is it actually live yet?

At least since 2020.

That's old news, but there's a new finder, only been around (even in
beta) a month or so ...
<https://9to5google.com/guides/find-my-device>

Opting out of the Find My Device network

Even with Google’s security measures in place and encrypted data
transfers between devices, you still may wish to opt out of the network.
The update brought along options to allow you to do that in a matter of
several steps.

On your Android device, open the Find My Device app.
Tap your profile picture.
Hit FInd My Device settings.
Tap Find your offline devices.
Choose what level of access the app has.

To get there works as said in my first posting.

[s|b]

Post by Jörg Lorenz
On your Android device, open the Find My Device app.

There's no such app on my Pixel 6. Apparently, I can install it, but the
function is already active (in my settings) and I don't see the point.
What am I going to do with the app? Find my own device?

[Andy Burns]

Post by s|b

Post by Jörg Lorenz
open the Find My Device app.

There's no such app on my Pixel 6. Apparently, I can install it, but the
function is already active (in my settings) and I don't see the point.
What am I going to do with the app? Find my own device?

That's been the only available functionality for the past few years, and
I've found it helpful once or twice, it can't actually do any "finding",
it can tell you where the device is (or last wa

[s|b]

Post by Andy Burns
That's been the only available functionality for the past few years, and
I've found it helpful once or twice, it can't actually do any "finding",
it can tell you where the device is (or last was before battery gave up).

I'm not sure if we're talking about the same thing here. I don't have
the app on my phone, because I can already use 'Find my phone/device'
through a browser. I simply activated it in my settings.

[Frank Slootweg]

Post by s|b

Post by Andy Burns
That's been the only available functionality for the past few years, and
I've found it helpful once or twice, it can't actually do any "finding",
it can tell you where the device is (or last was before battery gave up).

I'm not sure if we're talking about the same thing here. I don't have
the app on my phone, because I can already use 'Find my phone/device'
through a browser. I simply activated it in my settings.

It's an alternative for the web-browser. In order to find a device,
you need 1) *another* device and 2) an 'app' on that device. The 'app'
is either a general purpose web-browser or the dedicated 'Find My
Device' app.

[s|b]

Post by Frank Slootweg
It's an alternative for the web-browser. In order to find a device,
you need 1) *another* device and 2) an 'app' on that device. The 'app'
is either a general purpose web-browser or the dedicated 'Find My
Device' app.

Tnx for explaining.

[Stan Brown]

Post by Stan Brown
I don't have
the app on my phone, because I can already use 'Find my phone/device'
through a browser. I simply activated it in my settings.

Same here. I'm always reluctant to clutter up my hone
with app I don't actually need, and the Find My Device
in my PC's browser makes the phone emit a sound.

[micky]

In comp.mobile.android, on Thu, 30 May 2024 20:20:14 +0100, Andy Burns

Post by Andy Burns

Post by s|b

Post by Jörg Lorenz
open the Find My Device app.

There's no such app on my Pixel 6. Apparently, I can install it, but the
function is already active (in my settings) and I don't see the point.
What am I going to do with the app? Find my own device?

That's been the only available functionality for the past few years, and
I've found it helpful once or twice, it can't actually do any "finding",
it can tell you where the device is (or last was before battery gave up).

How precise is it. will it help me if it's somewhere in my house but I
don't know where?

[Andy Burns]

Post by micky
How precise is it. will it help me if it's somewhere in my house but I
don't know where?

It will be as accurate as whatever geolocation type you allow, for GPS
it'll probably tell which quarter of your house it's in, for wifi it
might nly distinguish between your house and your neighbour's, for cell
site it might only know which road it's on.

[micky]

In comp.mobile.android, on Fri, 31 May 2024 16:50:46 +0100, Andy Burns

Post by Andy Burns

Post by micky
How precise is it. will it help me if it's somewhere in my house but I
don't know where?

It will be as accurate as whatever geolocation type you allow, for GPS
it'll probably tell which quarter of your house it's in, for wifi it
might nly distinguish between your house and your neighbour's, for cell
site it might only know which road it's on.

Well, I know what road my house is on, so that won't help mch. GPS is
always on so that might help a lot.

Or maybe I should take Super Beta Mind Speeder. ;-)

[AJL]

How precise is it [FMDN]. will it help
me if it's somewhere in my house but I
don't know where?

I just use the other phone that lives
in my house to call mine and listen for
the ring. No second phone? Maybe Google
Voice from the laptop...

[Andy Burns]

Post by AJL

will it help me if it's somewhere in my house but I don't know
where?

I just use the other phone that lives
in my house to call mine and listen for
the ring. No second phone? Maybe Google
Voice from the laptop...

OK, so long as the battery hasn't subsequently gone flat, the findmy
option will at least tell you where it was ...

[micky]

In comp.mobile.android, on Fri, 31 May 2024 17:46:01 +0100, Andy Burns

Post by Andy Burns

Post by AJL

will it help me if it's somewhere in my house but I don't know
where?

I just use the other phone that lives
in my house to call mine and listen for
the ring. No second phone? Maybe Google
Voice from the laptop...

I do have a home phone, and I found the phone once your way. It was my
pants pockets on the floor of the bathroom. But I'd be happy with
another method too.

Post by Andy Burns
OK, so long as the battery hasn't subsequently gone flat, the findmy
option will at least tell you where it was ...

Aha, very good.

[Frank Slootweg]

Post by micky
In comp.mobile.android, on Thu, 30 May 2024 20:20:14 +0100, Andy Burns

Post by Andy Burns

Post by s|b

Post by Jörg Lorenz
open the Find My Device app.

There's no such app on my Pixel 6. Apparently, I can install it, but the
function is already active (in my settings) and I don't see the point.
What am I going to do with the app? Find my own device?

That's been the only available functionality for the past few years, and
I've found it helpful once or twice, it can't actually do any "finding",
it can tell you where the device is (or last was before battery gave up).

How precise is it. will it help me if it's somewhere in my house but I
don't know where?

If it's in your house, as AJL said, just call it from another phone.

If you don't have another phone, just use

'Find your phone'
<https://myaccount.google.com/find-your-phone>

on any device.

That will already play a notification sound (twice), but if you miss
that, just click on 'Play sound' and it will sound your ringtone on your
'lost' device ('device, not 'phone', because it also works for tablets).

[micky]

In comp.mobile.android, on 31 May 2024 18:59:11 GMT, Frank Slootweg

Post by Frank Slootweg

Post by micky
In comp.mobile.android, on Thu, 30 May 2024 20:20:14 +0100, Andy Burns

Post by Andy Burns

Post by s|b

Post by Jörg Lorenz
open the Find My Device app.

There's no such app on my Pixel 6. Apparently, I can install it, but the
function is already active (in my settings) and I don't see the point.
What am I going to do with the app? Find my own device?

That's been the only available functionality for the past few years, and
I've found it helpful once or twice, it can't actually do any "finding",
it can tell you where the device is (or last was before battery gave up).

How precise is it. will it help me if it's somewhere in my house but I
don't know where?

If it's in your house, as AJL said, just call it from another phone.
If you don't have another phone, just use
'Find your phone'
<https://myaccount.google.com/find-your-phone>
on any device.
That will already play a notification sound (twice), but if you miss
that, just click on 'Play sound' and it will sound your ringtone on your
'lost' device ('device, not 'phone', because it also works for tablets).

Thanks!

[Frank Slootweg]

Post by Jörg Lorenz

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

Is it actually live yet?

At least since 2020.
If you speak a little bit of German than you can see how easy it is to
https://www.heise.de/tipps-tricks/Google-Find-my-Device-so-funktioniert-s-6202798.html
or open settings. Go to search function and enter "find my" and enter.
There you are! Deactivate it!

Jörg,

As the subject says, the is about the Find My Device *network*, which
is a *new* feature, allowing "to locate your devices even if they're
offline".

'Finding your offline devices'
<https://support.google.com/android/answer/14796936?&p=find_offline_devices&rd=1#finding_offline_devices>

[Robert Roland]

On Wed, 29 May 2024 07:54:12 -0700, Stan Brown

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

[Carlos E.R.]

Post by Robert Roland
On Wed, 29 May 2024 07:54:12 -0700, Stan Brown

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

Right.

[Jörg Lorenz]

Post by Carlos E.R.

Post by Robert Roland
On Wed, 29 May 2024 07:54:12 -0700, Stan Brown

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

Right.

*Nonsense*
It is quite easy to turn it off!

[Jörg Lorenz]

Post by Robert Roland
On Wed, 29 May 2024 07:54:12 -0700, Stan Brown

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.

In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

The privacy implications are much more important than the number of
participating devices. I question your assumptions.

If you speak a little bit of German than you can see how easy it is to
turn it on and to turn it off again:

https://www.heise.de/tipps-tricks/Google-Find-my-Device-so-funktioniert-s-6202798.html

or open settings. Go to search function and enter "find my" and enter.
There you are! Deactivate it!

[Andy Burns]

Post by Robert Roland
In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

According to 9to5google, it has three states

Without network:
With network in high-traffic areas only:
With the network in all areas:

<https://9to5google.com/2024/04/03/android-find-my-device-network-live-early/>

under
Settings > Security & privacy > Device finders > Find My Device

I don't see those choices, but i can do a manual scan for trackers near me,

[Jörg Lorenz]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Robert Roland
In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

According to 9to5google, it has three states
<https://9to5google.com/2024/04/03/android-find-my-device-network-live-early/>
under
Settings > Security & privacy > Device finders > Find My Device
I don't see those choices, but i can do a manual scan for trackers near me,

Opting out is possible. I have just done it.

[Stan Brown]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Robert Roland
In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

According to 9to5google, it has three states
<https://9to5google.com/2024/04/03/android-find-my-device-network-live-early/>
under
Settings > Security & privacy > Device finders > Find My Device
I don't see those choices, but i can do a manual scan for trackers near me,

[end of article missing?]


On my Samsung A54, Android 14, OneUI 6.1, I have

Settings » Security and privacy » Lost device protection: Allow this
phone to be found in case it gets lost

Tapping that leads to a complaint "not signed in to Samsung
account," which is true. I wouldn't create a Microsoft account; why
would I create a Samsung one?

But I wonder: is Samsung maybe hiding Google's Find to push people
toward Samsung's? Samsung updates have been coming about once a week
lately, and who knows what's in them?

BTW, Frank Slootweg posted the answer that fits my phone exactly:
https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn

[Frank Slootweg]

Post by Stan Brown

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Robert Roland
In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

According to 9to5google, it has three states
<https://9to5google.com/2024/04/03/android-find-my-device-network-live-early/>
under
Settings > Security & privacy > Device finders > Find My Device
I don't see those choices, but i can do a manual scan for trackers near me,

[end of article missing?]
On my Samsung A54, Android 14, OneUI 6.1, I have
Settings Security and privacy Lost device protection: Allow this
phone to be found in case it gets lost
Tapping that leads to a complaint "not signed in to Samsung
account," which is true. I wouldn't create a Microsoft account; why
would I create a Samsung one?

You get that error, because you're in the *Samsung* 'Find My Mobile'
settings.

There is also the *Google* 'Find My Device' function. Note Samsung
"Mobile" versus Google "Device". Confusing, isn't it!? :-(

To get to the *Google* 'Find My Device' function (instructions for my
Samsung Galaxy A51 Android 13):

Settings -> Google / Google services -> 'All services' tab -> Find My
Device

Post by Stan Brown
But I wonder: is Samsung maybe hiding Google's Find to push people
toward Samsung's? Samsung updates have been coming about once a week
lately, and who knows what's in them?
https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn

[Andrew]

Post by Frank Slootweg

Post by Stan Brown
Tapping that leads to a complaint "not signed in to Samsung
account," which is true. I wouldn't create a Microsoft account; why
would I create a Samsung one?

You get that error, because you're in the *Samsung* 'Find My Mobile'
settings.

I already explained that in detail so it's disconcerting Stan said what he
did as it means Stan likely hasn't been reading anyone's responses about
this topic - and yet we all responded with great detail to assist him.

https://i.postimg.cc/25C1Jppb/findmy.jpg

[Andy Burns]

Post by Stan Brown
Settings » Security and privacy » Lost device protection: Allow this
phone to be found in case it gets lost

Although I have the new enough version of Play Services required by
FindMyDevice, I think it's not yet been enabled in the UK.

Post by Stan Brown
Tapping that leads to a complaint "not signed in to Samsung
account," which is true. I wouldn't create a Microsoft account; why
would I create a Samsung one?

I don't have a Samsung device, but haven't seen anything that says this
new feature requires a MySamsung account, maybe it can work as an
alternati

[s|b]

Post by Robert Roland
In a system like this, the number of participating devices is
critically important, so I doubt you will be allowed to turn it off.

Sorry, but that's BS.

[Frank Slootweg]

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.
Everything I could find told me to make settings changes in the Find
My Device app, but I don't have that app. Does that mean I'm not part
of the network, or do I need to install an app I don't want just to
opt out of a network I don't want?

I got an e-mail (today) from Google, saying the 'feature' will be
turned on in three days and with instructions how to opt out of the
network:

<https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn>

[Andrew]

Post by Frank Slootweg
I got an e-mail (today) from Google, saying the 'feature' will be
turned on in three days and with instructions how to opt out of the
<https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn>

I'd never get that email from Google, I would think, simply because there
is no Google account set up on my Android phone (although I do have plenty
of Google Accounts - just none are set up explicitly on the Android phone).

However, I did go to the link Frank kindly posted to see what it tells me:
<https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn>
"No active devices
Before you can use Find My Device,
you must have an active Android device."

Hence, apparently, one way for the OP to opt out of this new bluetooth
feature is, perhaps, to simply not set up an account on their device.

Moving forward toward a better understanding of this new feature, and
thanks to Frank & Andy (and thanks to the OP, Stan), I read their links to
better understand this new find-my feature released, apparently, in the
Google Play Services <com.google.android.gms> beta version (v24.12.14).

When I look in Muntashirakon App Manager, my Google Play Services is
Version 23.33.16 (190400-560149061) (233316044)

I'm curious what version people are on who got the email from Google.

[Andy Burns]

Post by Andrew
I'm curious what version people are on who got the email from Google.

I didn't get the email, most likely because the new feature isn't
enabled in the UK yet, but I do have Play Services 24.20.13, which is
higher than the beta.

[Andrew]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Andrew
I'm curious what version people are on who got the email from Google.

I didn't get the email, most likely because the new feature isn't
enabled in the UK yet, but I do have Play Services 24.20.13, which is
higher than the beta.

Thanks for confirmation that the rollout is (as I think I saw in one of the
previous links) mainly to the USA & Canada at the moment, even as the beta
is in Google Play Services <com.google.android.gms> v24.12.14 beta & above.

Obviously I'll opt out even as the default is to opt in when I do get
updated to that level; but one question I have that hasn't been answered is
whether or not the bluetooth radio needs to "show" that it's turned on.

That is, does anyone know if you simply turn off your bluetooth radio, will
that prevent the related communications with other devices from occurring?

... uh oh... bad news... I googled before sending this... and found out...

Oh my! Google is rather clever, as can be inferred from this, which implies
you can turn Bluetooth off only temporarily in Android 15. It's pause only!

*Android 15 really doesn't want you to turn off Bluetooth*
<https://www.androidauthority.com/android-15-bluetooth-auto-on-3431445/>
"Android 15 will add a new feature that can automatically turn
on Bluetooth the day after you've disabled it.
Your phone's Bluetooth radio is used for several key Android features,
such as Quick Share and Find My Device.
Disabling Bluetooth will slightly improve battery, but the trade-off
is that your device won't be able to contribute to Google's Find My
Device network."

Does anyone have Android 15 who can confirm that Bluetooth is pause only?

[Andy Burns]

Post by Andrew
Does anyone have Android 15 who can confirm that Bluetooth is pause only?

No, my Pixel5a is too old to get the beta of 15 (not that I'm tempted to
run betas on my main phone). I'm still deciding whether to buy a
Pixel8, an 8a or hold on a few months for a 9Pro.

[Andrew]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Andrew
Does anyone have Android 15 who can confirm that Bluetooth is pause only?

No, my Pixel5a is too old to get the beta of 15 (not that I'm tempted to
run betas on my main phone). I'm still deciding whether to buy a
Pixel8, an 8a or hold on a few months for a 9Pro.

Like you, my Android update is probably topped out (mine is at Android 13).
However, the new bluetooth find my device works on most Androids.
"The new Find My Device works with devices running Android 9+."

I'm glad Stan asked this question as I was unaware that this existed,
where, googling a bit, I find this description a bit disconcerting...

"thanks to specialized Pixel hardware, Pixel 8 and 8 Pro owners
will also be able to find their devices if they're powered off
or the battery is dead"
<https://blog.google/products/android/android-find-my-device/>

That means, I guess, what we discussed in the past, is that a phone which
is simply indicating that it's off, isn't necessarily off after all.

Likewise, based on your own PNG screenshot, a bluetooth radio which
indicates that it's off many not, in reality, be "really" off...
<http://andyburns.uk/misc/findmy-helppage.png>
(although I saw your response that it may mean it already happened
when the bluetooth radio was on prior and you're just too late turning it
off).

That's going to be the most important question to answer, especially as a
"dead" or "off" phone is still doing the tracking according to the blog.

[Andy Burns]

Post by Andrew
"thanks to specialized Pixel hardware, Pixel 8 and 8 Pro owners
will also be able to find their devices if they're powered off
or the battery is dead"
That means, I guess, what we discussed in the past, is that a phone which
is simply indicating that it's off, isn't necessarily off after all.

I think the CPU, wifi and 4G/5G radios will be off, but the last thing
the CPU will do is pre-compute the "I'm lost" beacon packets and put the
bluetooth radio into a special mode where it repeatedly transmits them
(maybe at decreasing frequency?)

[Chris Green]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Andrew
"thanks to specialized Pixel hardware, Pixel 8 and 8 Pro owners
will also be able to find their devices if they're powered off
or the battery is dead"
That means, I guess, what we discussed in the past, is that a phone which
is simply indicating that it's off, isn't necessarily off after all.

I think the CPU, wifi and 4G/5G radios will be off, but the last thing
the CPU will do is pre-compute the "I'm lost" beacon packets and put the
bluetooth radio into a special mode where it repeatedly transmits them
(maybe at decreasing frequency?)

How does Bluetooth help? I'm much more likely to lose my phone in the
middle of an empty field than somewhere at home in range of other
Bluetooth devices.

[Andy Burns]

Post by Chris Green
How does Bluetooth help?

BLE can have quite a range, hundreds of feet, but they system is
designed around having other people around to do the finding,

Post by Chris Green
I'm much more likely to lose my phone in the
middle of an empty field than somewhere at home in range of other
Bluetooth devices.

bluetooth is your only realistic choice though, it has to be something
the lost device can transmit, you can receive, and not too much of a
burden on the batteries ... yo could always go into your field with
another phone to search for the lost one?

[Stan Brown]

Post by Frank Slootweg

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.
Everything I could find told me to make settings changes in the Find
My Device app, but I don't have that app. Does that mean I'm not part
of the network, or do I need to install an app I don't want just to
opt out of a network I don't want?

I got an e-mail (today) from Google, saying the 'feature' will be
turned on in three days and with instructions how to opt out of the
<https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn>

Thanks for that, Frank: it exactly solves my problem.

I haven't received emails, I don't think, but definitely multiple
notifications on the phone for about the last week. The settings
mentioned in your article do exist on my phone. It was set to "with
network in high-traffic areas only" and I changed it to "without
network."

I'm not so much concerned about privacy--that ship has sailed with
Google--but about battery use from being constantly on line. I have
Power Saver selected, but still I'm lucky to go 48 hours without
recharging.

I've bookmarked that link -- it can be handy to find the phone when I
can't remember where in the house I set it down. :-) While I'm moving
house, everything is topsy turvy, and it's easy to lose track of
almost anything temporarily.

[Andy Burns]

Post by Stan Brown
I'm not so much concerned about privacy--that ship has sailed with
Google--but about battery use from being constantly on line. I have
Power Saver selected, but still I'm lucky to go 48 hours without
recharging.

I wouldn't think data usage would be very high, after all it only has t
report the location of a 'lost' device if it finds one. We'll have to
see whether listening for lost beacons over bluetooth is battery
intensive, or not.

[s|b]

Post by Frank Slootweg
I got an e-mail (today) from Google, saying the 'feature' will be
turned on in three days and with instructions how to opt out of the
<https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn>

Same here. I got the e-mail on May 22, but so far no notification and no
option to opt out (because it isn't active yet?).

[s|b]

Post by s|b
Same here. I got the e-mail on May 22, but so far no notification and no
option to opt out (because it isn't active yet?).

The e-mail refers to
<https://support.google.com/android/?p=find_offline_devices>

I checked again on my Pixel and it has the option 'Find your offline
devices' as shown in the screenshot. It's set to OFF (not by my doing,
maybe Google choose 'opt in' instead of 'opt out', for European users?)

[Frank Slootweg]

Post by Frank Slootweg

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.
Everything I could find told me to make settings changes in the Find
My Device app, but I don't have that app. Does that mean I'm not part
of the network, or do I need to install an app I don't want just to
opt out of a network I don't want?

I got an e-mail (today) from Google, saying the 'feature' will be
turned on in three days and with instructions how to opt out of the
<https://www.google.com/android/find/settings/fmdn>

And indeed today, I got a notification on my phone that the
functionality is live and enabled (and with a pointer to the settings,
so you can check/change them).

For now, I've kept the 'Find your offline devices' setting set to
'With network in high-traffic areas only'.

(Other settings are 'Off', 'Without network' and 'With network in all
areas'. All with panels which can be opened to see explanations of each
choice.)

[Andrew]

Post by Stan Brown
I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about this here. I've been
googling (!) for a way to opt out of using my bandwidth and my
battery to be part of this network.
Everything I could find told me to make settings changes in the Find
My Device app, but I don't have that app. Does that mean I'm not part
of the network, or do I need to install an app I don't want just to
opt out of a network I don't want?

Andy Burns is helping you, and he knows more than I do, but I don't
understand fully what you're asking - but I think I do the same thing???

I've long ago opted out of any find-my-device mechanism on my Android 13
Galaxy simply because I'm worried about possible privacy implications.

What did I do?
I simply never opted in (as far as I can recall)...

Searching the Samsung Android settings for "Find My" locates a couple of
activities, one is Samsung specific and the other appears to be Android.

Samsung: Find my mobile
Android: Find my device

Neither one of which works on my device.
<Loading Image...>

Hence, since I'm not sure I understand your question, may I ask you...

*Isn't the way to opt out simply to not opt in?*

[Andrew]

Post by Andrew
Hence, since I'm not sure I understand your question, may I ask you...
*Isn't the way to opt out simply to not opt in?*

Ah, I see you're asking about a brand new feature, based on what both Andy
& Frank apprised Joerg of... <https://i.postimg.cc/25C1Jppb/findmy.jpg>

<https://9to5google.com/guides/find-my-device/>
<https://9to5google.com/2024/04/03/android-find-my-device-network-live-early/>
<https://support.google.com/android/answer/14796936?&p=find_offline_devices&rd=1#finding_offline_devices>

Note my "Google Play Services" <com.google.android.gms> is currently
below the beta version (v24.12.14) said to contain the new features.
Version 23.33.16 (190400-560149061) (233316044)

Let's see what this new thing is all about...

"The Find My Device network piggybacks off of all Android phones
with Google Play Services to help users find lost items..."

"In the latest beta version of Google Play Services, v24.12.14,
a new Find your offline devices is appearing in the Settings
menu for some users."

"This leads to another page with options to find devices without
the network, with the network in high-traffic areas, and with
the network all of the time. Users can also turn the feature
off entirely. By default, the option is turned on & to all areas."

"Google's Find My Device network has been slow to come to all
Android devices, but if you buy a supported tracker, it will be
activated during the initial setup phase on your device."

"You can check if you have the network on your device. Open the
Find Device app, tap on your profile picture, and then tap
Find My Device settings. From there, you'll know if you have
the network live if you see Find your offline devices and
the menu it brings"

"If you don't yet have the network, be sure to accept any app
or system updates. Google is rolling this out as a server-side
update, so you shouldn't need any other updates, but it
generally helps to be on the latest available version."

"Android devices participating in the Find My Device network
use Bluetooth to scan for nearby items. If they detect your items,
they securely send the location where they detected the items
to Find My Device. Your Android device does the same to help
others find their lost items when it detects them nearby."

"You can control how your Android device participates in the
network at any time by visiting Find your offline devices
in the Find My Device settings.

[Andy Burns]

Post by Andrew
Samsung: Find my mobile
Android: Find my device
Neither one of which works on my device.
<https://i.postimg.cc/25C1Jppb/findmy.jpg>

That version relies on the device having geolocation enabled, so it
knows where it is, reports that to google so that later you can ask
google where it was when it last reported its own location.

The new version, doesn't rely on that; it relies on other people
constantly listening for your phone saying "help my owner has lost me,
do you know where I am?" Then other people report your phone's location
to google. Even the latest phones will have this 'beacon' running when
they're switched off and a battery that's not even got enough charge to
turn on (but *just* enough to run the bluetooth by itself).

Post by Andrew
Hence, since I'm not sure I understand your question, may I ask you...
*Isn't the way to opt out simply to not opt in?*

Stan doesn't want to use-up his battery/bandwidth, listening out for
other people's lost devices. Seems like he will be able to opt out.

[Andrew]

Post by Andy Burns

Post by Andrew
Hence, since I'm not sure I understand your question, may I ask you...
*Isn't the way to opt out simply to not opt in?*

Stan doesn't want to use-up his battery/bandwidth, listening out for
other people's lost devices. Seems like he will be able to opt out.

Thanks for patiently explaining what, at first, I had not understood.
Much appreciated, as there are only a handful of people I can learn from on
this newsgroup, you being one of them (Frank was also helpful in this too).

Seeking to answer Stan's question, the first issue is it apparently uses
bluetooth, so, I would think (hope?) that the bluetooth radio can simply be
turned off.

Yet, maybe not, as the "default" will be for this feature to be turned on,
so, maybe (I don't know yet), the bluetooth radio will be on, but hidden?

Question 1: Does turning off the bluetooth radio disable this feature?

Moving on, a second way to disable this feature, at least from the
perspective of finding your own devices, might be to simply opt out.

Question 2: Does opting out only prevent you from finding your own devices?
(or does opting out also prevent you from finding others' too?)

Moving on further into the realm of opting out, I noticed the feature
requires two things that I don't have (but which most people do have).
a. It (apparently) requires a lock on the device
b. It (apparently) requires an account on the device
I have neither; but I don't dispute that most people have both.

This really brings up question 2 above again, with the difference being if
you can't use this feature (because of lack of an account set up on the
phone, or lack of a password set up on that account set up on the phone),
does that prevent the bluetooth bandwidth of the phone from being used?

[Andy Burns]

Post by Andrew
Seeking to answer Stan's question, the first issue is it apparently uses
bluetooth, so, I would think (hope?) that the bluetooth radio can simply be
turned off.

That was my first answer here, but maybe not ...

<Loading Image...>

it could be that when you get an alert, it's too late to turn off
bluetooth as the lost phone has already been locate by yours, or it
could be be that even when bluetooth is "off" it's still listening for
findmydevice beacons ... similar to how wifi being "off" it can still be
used for BSSID location (unless you turn it *really* off).

Post by Andrew
Yet, maybe not, as the "default" will be for this feature to be turned on,
so, maybe (I don't know yet), the bluetooth radio will be on, but hidden?

Suppose we'll have to wait and see ...

This new feature is intended to work with Apple Airtags and those "Tile"
trackers you can put on your keyring or in your wallet.

[Andrew]

Post by Andy Burns
That was my first answer here, but maybe not ...
<http://andyburns.uk/misc/findmy-helppage.png>

Thanks for that PNG:
"What to do if you get an unknown tracker alert.
If you turn off Bluetooth or Location Services or turn on aeroplane
mode your phone won't prevent the owner of the tracker or device
from finding the location of the tracker."

Yikes!

That implies that the Bluetooth radio is lying when it says it's off.
Does it not?

[Andy Burns]

Post by Andrew
"What to do if you get an unknown tracker alert.
If you turn off Bluetooth or Location Services or turn on aeroplane
mode your phone won't prevent the owner of the tracker or device
from finding the location of the tracker."
Yikes!
That implies that the Bluetooth radio is lying when it says it's off.
Does it not?

Either that, or by the time you've got an alert it's too late to turn
off bluetooth as it's already been detected.

[Andy Burns]

Post by Andy Burns
This new feature is intended to work with Apple Airtags and those "Tile"
trackers you can put on your keyring  or in your wallet.

It seems the apple/android interoperability is much less than I'd
thought, the two companies have only co-operated as far as "stalking"
detection is concerned, it won't allow apple things to locate android
things or vice-versa.

Also FMDN won't work with existing Tile devices, they only use other
phones with the Tile app installed.

There are new Chipolo Point devices, and PebbleBee for Android devices
available (be careful to buy the correct models)

<https://chipolo.net/en/products/chipolo-point-bundle>
<https://pebblebee.com/pages/google-find-my-device>

Other manufacturers (Eufy, JioTag) are expected very soon (again, don't
buy current models, they are not compatible) I presume Tile will have
new models too, or they'll d